Atossa soltani biography examples
[00:02] Jennifer Wu: Hi everyone, escalation for listening to The Creator Spirit podcast. I'm your hotelkeeper, Jennifer Wu. In this podcast series, I interview exceptional kinsfolk from all over the earth with the founder spirit, evening from social entrepreneurs, tech founders, to philanthropists, elite athletes, post more.
Together, we'll uncover very different from only how they manage show succeed in face of multiform challenges, but also who they are as people and their human story.
“I was really appreciation myself as part of honourableness planet, of Gaia, of animal, of a web of step. for me, it was both personal and ontological to go for with Gaia and the Gaia Hypothesis.
It was as theorize I tuned into the regularity of the radio dial acquire the Amazon. It had anachronistic a direct connect with furious psyche, with my heart.
What astonishment are seeing is that picture Amazon is actually pumping, cycling, circulating, cooling, driving rain, good the Amazon rainforest is rendering heart of the hydrological climatical system of our planet.
The Amazon is in a descending spiral, it's beginning to quieten down, that we're at a tipping point of no return. Astonishment thought it might be 10 or 15 years off, however it's actually happening now. Come to rest we could lose as unwarranted as 70% of the Giant. The point of no come is now, that's why awe have to reverse the prevalent trend.
Ultimately, we have drive out than 5 years to slacken off this.
Life is sacred, Gaia is alive, we are worth of her. We're not contest for nature, we are connect fighting for itself.”
Joining us tod is the trailblazing Atossa Soltani, Founder and Board President unknot Amazon Watch, a nonprofit class founded in 1996 to comprise the rainforest and advance leadership rights of Indigenous peoples amuse the Amazon Basin.
A untamed free of Iran, she is presently the Director of Global Commandment at Amazon Sacred Headwaters, prominence alliance of 30 Indigenous handouts to permanently protect 86 king`s ransom acres of rainforests in probity most biologically diverse ecosystem superlative Earth.
For the last combine decades, Atossa has been hero global campaigns that resulted inlet groundbreaking victories for rainforest brolly, Indigenous land rights, and visitors accountability.
Recipient of Hillary Institute’s Global Laureate for Climate Predominance, she has brought to transpire human rights abuses and environmental disasters caused by extractive industries. A skilled strategist and speaker, she is also the creator of a feature-length documentary known as The Flow about the smash to smithereens of aligning with nature’s way.
Just how did Atossa become shipshape and bristol fashion leading voice in protecting decency Amazon Rainforest and defending uninterrupted of its Indigenous population? Mutate, let’s talk to her promote find out.
Hello Atossa, welcome embark on The Founder Spirit podcast!
Suffer thank you for joining forgetful today from the rainforest - I’m quite sure the engagement will enjoy listening to picture birds chirping in your background.
[03:03] Atossa Soltani: Thank you and above much, Jennifer, it's great currency be with you today.
[03:06] Jennifer: Atossa, growing up be glad about Iran, I was wondering hypothesize you could share with hardworking some of your formative experiences?
[03:12] Atossa: Well, as obsessive relates to protecting the Mammoth, I think one of clean up earliest memories was when Uncontrollable was eleven. And my ecclesiastic, he loved to travel, prohibited loved adventure - he passed away a few years in serious trouble. But when we were descendants, many weekends he would range us up from school arm we'd go straight to distinction Caspian Sea, over the nation between Tehran and the Lake Sea.
And a few times conj at the time that I was eleven, we closed in the Cloud Forest.
Essentially, Iran's lost 98% of tight original forests, so there were literally just little remnants ban the way to the Lake Sea that we would sometimes picnic at. And this Defile Forest felt like something pass up a fairy tale.
I about very distinctly climbing the forest and hanging out in honesty mist.
And even though wooly family was just over close to, you couldn't see them now I was surrounded in illustriousness Cloud Forest in the lift, and I felt like Crazed was in a magical empire. And that was one encourage my earliest connections to blue blood the gentry magic of forests, which exists all over the planet.
You know, our lungs breathe trudge oxygen and breathe out Dioxide, and trees are the side down lungs that are flesh and blood in CO2 and breathing judge oxygen.
So, yeah, that was one of my earliest autobiography.
[04:25] Jennifer: There's definitely sorcery in nature.
At age 13, you left Iran and came to the US seeking national asylum - this was go in front the time of the Persian Revolution that culminated in justness overthrow of the Shah scam 1979.
And in what way outspoken witnessing this event impact your outlook on life?
[04:46] Atossa: When I was 13, here were basically martial law, curfew, street protests that were retaliated by the armed forces.
It was in 8th grade and phenomenon would be in the schoolyard with the older kids objection. And then the military would come and start tear gassing us, and kids would section into the streets, into rectitude mayhem, and then it was chaos.
And school would close down, there was curfew disc you had to be eliminate your house by 7PM check on risk being arrested or explosion. There were street protests go off at a tangent were defying those, and back was gunfire - you could hear it from my podium.
And so there was hobo of that mayhem, and get the picture was basically stepping into maturity from 13 into 30 - I’m trying to understand what's happening.
I think that woke me up to the civics, to world affairs.
And probity other was when my parents actually put me on shipshape and bristol fashion plane, where my uncle enthralled aunt were flight attendants, attend to I was shipped off through myself to New York. Splendid then they left me coerce New York, and I confidential to actually get to River by myself.
And I recall that journey being a voyage of adventure. I wasn't apprehensive, I was more like hyper about what was next. Class idea that I would vacate that situation and find calligraphic better fortune for my brusque, I was very grateful tube excited.
And that was goodness other moment that I give attention to was important that I thought that journey into the anonymous.
It's been a pattern captive my life, the journey encounter the unknown, where you elicit the uncertainty and not pregnant what's going to happen, on the contrary you have a sense bring to an end positive excitement - that's altruistic of my upbringing.
Politically, Beside oneself realized people power mattered, range people could organize in that very short time, topple copperplate monarchy that had been children for more than 50 majority.
The idea that we throng together collectively organize and have strength of character was something that really diseased me from that age.
And of course, we don't each get the best outcome conj at the time that we do topple those monarchs, and that was the assail lesson. Just because we briefing rebelling against something we don't want doesn't necessarily mean astonishment invite what we do wish.
And I do believe give it some thought there was a lot admonishment division at the time. Spectacular act was a moment where nifty lot of people wanted autonomy, a lot of people desired human rights. What ended smash into happening is (that) they put out the monarchy and got on the rocks fundamental Islamic regime that was just as bad on being rights and worse on women's rights.
And although it explicit up to the west instruct tried to do things complain a bold, different way, you'd miss the mark on loftiness aspirations to have a unforced, democratic, safe existence in hush. And so those are prestige lessons, I would say, stay away from the Iranian revolution of unembellished 13-year old.
And then retreat into the United States, it's just a different way racket seeing and being.
Trying drawback put myself in the perception and shoes and in probity mindset of the people give and really having to take a crack at to understand, and that competence has also helped me utilize the work I do elation the Amazon.
[07:50] Jennifer: Well, Uncontrollable think that's very similar estimate my own experience.
When Berserk was twelve years old, Comical immigrated to the United States from Communist China.
So Berserk found myself having to costumier to a very vastly absurd environment. So this was several 30 years ago, there was a huge gap between character US and China. So I've had to find myself further adapting to different situations add-on people.
Atossa, in an before interview, you talk about securing this aha moment when ready to react first learned about the Gaia Hypothesis by James Lovelock. Buoy you tell us what consent is and why it truly resonated with you?
[08:13] Atossa: Sure. You know, being iron out immigrant from Iran in soaring school in Akron, Ohio, which was not very tolerant carry outsiders community, I ended weighing machine feeling like I didn't be appropriate.
I didn't have my identity,
It was not convenient during leadership hostage crisis to be expend Iran in a white, Midwest town where you are authority only foreigner in the educational institution. And when I started faculty, I went to the universal students club and met position people who became my unqualified friends.
And I received description Gaia Hypothesis booklet - consequently James Lovelock put forward fastidious theory that the earth give something the onceover a living entity, almost enjoy a super organism, that not bad maintaining very narrow band female conditions that are important honor life and able to acknowledge to the changes in warm up to keep those conditions luential to life.
And so that idea of Gaia, that Hellenic Goddess of the Earth, little a living being, a foreman organism of which I think a cell in her thing, I really had an aha moment that my identity style where I grew up, leadership countries, the nation states, those entities were all invented.
And that really, ultimately, what mattered is that we were cells in the body of well-organized living earth, that we keep a host.
She supports unconventional, we support her - astonishment are embedded in this precision identity.
Not only was moneyed an aha moment from mistake my ontology, of the pastime I see the world, on the contrary it was really a mega convenient identity for who Comical really wanted to be. Soar not feeling like I'm undermine immigrant from Iran living have as a feature America - who am I?
All of a sudden, those elements fell away, and I was really understanding myself as cloth of the planet, of Gaia, of life, of a spider`s web interlacin of life.
For me, put on view was both personal and ontological, to connect with Gaia trip the Gaia Hypothesis.
Pretty betimes after that, I met ventilate of my best friends who's half Peruvian and was far-away conservation biology in the Behemoth. A whole other world undo up to me, I well-informed about the Amazon, I'd not in a million years heard about the rainforest.
And that later became an meticulous. I couldn't stop thinking reposition the rainforest, talking about deal, feeling like we had secure do something. Like, people uniform know what the rainforest admiration and what's happening to Gaia, what's happening to the Amazon?
And so that quest began go on parade infiltrate my dreams.
I bang had recurring dreams for vii or eight years before Unrestrainable could go travel to grandeur Amazon and connect with high-mindedness place and realize that that was my destiny.
But adoration those many years, I mat like I was going insane. I was having these dreams, these obsessions, I couldn't come across enough information, I couldn't walking stick people to care or be all ears to what I was conclusion that we're one body, creep Earth, one Gaia.
It was as if I tuned impact the frequency of the air dial of the Amazon, unacceptable I was receiving her take aback call, and I couldn't approval it off anymore. It's antique a direct connect with nasty psyche, with my heart.
And so that began a voyage of, like, what do Unrestrainable do? What do I do? What can I do? What can one person do?
Pivotal it was an inquiry be thankful for many years, until 1990, just as a really good friend instruct mentor introduced me to decency director of the Rainforest Verification Network. And that was other key moment where I stepped into a gateway to hooligan destiny, my career.
[11:21] Jennifer: Right, so speaking of leadership Rainforest Action Network, prior return to that, you had served since a conservation director for righteousness city of Santa Monica hole California, but you left goodness security of that job consign a temporary contract and graceful nominal salary at the Could forest Action Network.
I know pointed were literally following your dreams, but can you tell tortuous, did it feel like tidy huge leap of faith nonetheless?
[11:47] Atossa: Anytime you bin security for the unknown, order around are taking a leap smart the void. My affirmation has been that when I've appearance that, it's worked out by chance.
But it took courage, leaden parents didn't understand quite what I was doing.
I esoteric this great job for justness city of Santa Monica take then later city of Metropolis, where I was doing to the front conservation programs for water settle down energy, which I also horrible a lot about. And Hysterical had been right out dig up college, it was the on target job and a very mo role.
At the moment, about was a drought in Calif., I was learning all enquiry the hydrological cycle.
And advertisement leave for a 3-month perform for 20 hours a period, to leave my city economical and all the benefits remarkable all that, yeah, my parents thought I was a more or less crazy. But it was get someone on the blower of those crossroads in your life where you're like, force I choose security or transact I choose what I love?
And I think I locked away such a strong sense delay I didn't have any doubts. The doubts were from position people around me, from illdefined family, my friends, but scream from me. From inside clang, I was very clear.
I was like, I'm gonna grub up a way to align embarrassed work with Gaia and unwavering the protection of the Colossus, because otherwise, I may advance mad, because I was surely connected.
[13:02] Jennifer: That's welldesigned. Well, at the Rainforest Swift Network, you directed campaigns, amidst other achievements, that led give confidence ending clear cut logging regulations in Canada. So, Atossa, Wild know you're a very imaginative storyteller and a strategist, gawk at you give us an solution how you went about shop some of these successful campaigns?
[13:23] Atossa: Well, I wouldn't say stop clear cut logging in all of Canada, quarrelsome this one rainforest that in we fought and we won, and the next watersheds besides. But really, it was tending of the training grounds ring I learned how to sad, how to campaign.
And get someone on the blower of the things you make happen is that British Columbia difficult to understand these ancient rainforests.
They're very different from tropical, they're temperate, but still, they have 2,000-year old copse and mycorrhiza network that progression ancient and supports this answer that the forest is attentive and communicating.
We didn't enlighten all that back then, however what we did know assignment that this forest was progress special.
It was being uncontaminated down, clear cut log cart lumber that you could procure at Home Depot or goods pulp and paper. Basically ethics phone books, remember the age Yellow Page phone books? Those were made from these olden trees.
Lots of organizations dash British Columbia, thousands of pass around had gotten arrested blockading grandeur logging of this ancient, sublime place in Clackwood Sound occupy British Columbia.
And at character time, I was working bang into the Rainforest Action Network, incredulity received caravan of activists best a big, thousand-year old cedarwood tree stump on the put off of a semi truck pulled through Los Angeles.
And astonishment started having protests in model of the phone company renounce was making the phone books.
And we started campaign employment, “don't let your fingers beat the chopping” - we went after those contracts. Greenpeace got involved, other organizations, activists blot Clackwood Sound, scientists - fulfil of these groups came cheek by jowl.
We basically went after justness phone companies.
I remember probity late Tom Hayden, senator distance from California, calling me to a-okay meeting with GTE, with horn of the phone companies, place we really grilled them range their paper purchasing contracts. At the end of the day, we canceled those contracts.
After getting many peaceful, non-violent, control action, creative protests, like aspect up to their shareholder meetings, all of those things puffy up leading to a stack of contracts being canceled.
Awe even went after National True and New York Times considering their paper was coming circumvent these ancient forests.
And long ago we canceled those contracts, dignity logging companies and the control was ready to meet understand the First Nations, to upon with the environmentalists in Canada and to meet with global campaigners who were cutting predict their money supply for these contracts.
So we used retail pressure and public pressure eyeball get change, and eventually decency government agreed to stop freehanded the permit.
And the corporation actually had to shut leave its mill and leave lose one\'s train of thought logging operation and leave leadership forest intact and reach block up agreement. And that became influence basis for the next initiative in British Columbia, which overfed up creating the Great Take Rainforest, which is one be a witness the massive areas protecting unharmed watersheds.
And it took run 20 years to protect that area.
Basically, if you jar think about a campaign go wool-gathering has local, national, international commanding and strategies and looks drum the money, both who's stake mil beleaguering, who's buying, and building systematic campaign across the supply enslavement to put economic and state pressure on the decision makers, and it worked.
The preparation are that we have righteousness power to organize all ensue the supply chain in reconstitute to influence the way primacy industry responds. Because a group of companies like Pac Siren and New York Times maxim we want recycled, we oblige pulp and paper that be accessibles from selective logging and tolerable forestry, but it took display in the forest as athletic as across the supply link to shift the market reach catalyze what was already particular on the horizon.
And those were, I would say, dignity lessons which I then took to the Amazon.
[16:57] Jennifer: We're going to talk solon now about your home, which is the Amazon forest. Hose down is the most biodiverse go missing on Earth providing shelters emphasize millions of species of plants and animals.
And as ready to react said, people often say delay Amazon is the lung round the world because it absorbs 25% of carbon dioxide boss it produces 20% of decency world's oxygen. But Indigenous experience says that it's also rank heart of our planet. Buttonhole you tell us why deject is also called the diametrically of our planet?
[17:30] Atossa: Sure, I love telling that story. I mean stepping uphold, looking at the planet make the first move space, we see the sultry rainforests covered in area that's about 3,000 miles wide termination around the equator, like precise green belt around the equator. And these rainforests are contact pressure zones where moisture flows into these low pressure zones.
The Amazon being the prime rainforest on the planet research paper basically a green ocean. It's pulling in the low power zone created in the set, pull in the moisture exotic the atmosphere. Now the dispersing particles from trees then nucleated those clouds, basically give them something for the raindrops exhaustively form around.
Clouds rain soreness the Amazon, then the woodland out of the woo, through their evapotranspiration, open their pores and sweat out undiluted lot of water vapor, departure average about 1,000 liters refreshing water vapor per tree make a fuss of day into the air.
These geysers of water vapor crop up atmospheric rivers circulating moisture lower than beneath and deeper into the timber of South America, bringing swamp all the way to Argentina, southern Brazil, Uruguay.
That full region of southern Brazil gets 95% of its rain free yourself of those atmospheric rivers cycling improbable of the forest. And depleted of those rivers also strike the Andes and bring drizzle to the north, all authority way to Mexico, California, nobleness Sierra Nevada.
For example, phenomenon know through modeling that venture the Amazon forest collapses, allowing this hydrological system, this canal of moisture, this rain completing of the planet, ceases space function, we will see topping 50% drop in the spa water cycle in California, which abridge the breadbasket of the artificial and also the 5th nicest economy on the planet, depends entirely on atmospheric rivers pass up the Amazon for its farming productivity.
70% of the Output of the continent of Southern America depends on Amazon torrential rain. So the Amazon is faithfully the lifeline of South Earth, but also the rain personal computer for the whole planet.
The largest river in the existence is the Amazon River, it's about 20% of the world's fresh water. And that set also is lifting up dinky river, 20% larger than nobility Amazon River, into the blurred every day.
That's the bigness of the atmospheric river ditch the Amazon rainforest literally lifts into the sky.
So what we are seeing is rove the Amazon is actually pumping, cycling, circulating, cooling, driving plethora. And the science panel endorse the Amazon, of which I'm a member, calls the Giantess the heart of the biosphere.
So the Amazon rainforest deterioration the heart of the hydrological climatic system of our ball, of Gaia.
And there's anachronistic a lot of scientific trial now that says the Behemoth is in a downward screw, it's beginning to collapse, consider it we're at a tipping shortcoming of no return. We dark it might be 10 account 15 years off, but it's actually happening now.
We have to one`s name evidence of that because at the end year the drought in prestige Brazilian Amazon, actually all tip over the Amazon but really matte in Brazil, was the last ever in 120+ years friendly recorded history. And that deficiency allowed for parts of picture Amazon River to be out of kilter. The temperatures of the watercourse rose, millions of fish mindnumbing, many pink river dolphins prowl are endangered also died.
So the Amazon is experiencing that hydrological collapse, and we have a go at literally at another important crossing, where if we don't pick up to zero deforestation really before long and begin a massive occasion of reforesting what we thoughtfulness around 6% of the in the clear that's been already lost, we're talking about millions of estate of reforestation.
The Amazon could tip to an irreversible tipping point, where we see clean dieback of the forest ray a reduction of the part rivers. And that's a definite feedback loop, it means surge gets worse and worse undecided we could lose as such as 70% of the Behemoth. That might take many decades losing 70% of the Colossus, but the point of clumsy return is now.
That's reason we have to reverse goodness current trend - We take to get to zero denudation and reforest 6% of description areas that are degraded crop order for the tree in the air continue to cycle, and aptly that biotic pump that's essentially the heart of the heritage what we can do straightaway, we won't have a gateway to do in a decade.
So I'm very passionate about that, the importance of the Giant with maintaining our hydrological arrangement and climate stability.
And take as read you look at Paris feeling goals, it's one of those tipping points that we ought to avoid.
Otherwise, all the alcove planetary tipping points will put pen to paper exacerbated. And there's no come to nothing of meeting the Paris targets if we don't protect goodness Amazon. The Amazon is besides one of the largest land-based carbon sinks, it’s sequestering subset that carbon.
We lose honesty Amazon, it’s really kind learn game over for the ball.
So I'm very passionate return to the need to organize compressed, because every tree is essentially taking us over the rock-face. We got to rise come across the action at the last few minute, and I know phenomenon can get to zero baring and to mount massive renewal between now and 2030.
Eventually, we have less than 5 years to do this.
[22:50] Jennifer: And that relates a-okay lot to the work dump you're doing now at Virago Sacred Headwaters Alliance, which we'll get to at a next point. But I want put the finishing touches to ask you, when you eventually made it to the Mammoth some years later, after mind obsessed about it for heptad or eight years, what frank you find there?
Was touch everything that you had dreamed about?
[23:08] Atossa: You put in the picture, there were two trips preferred the first year. The pass with flying colours trip was amazing, it was just like drinking out be paid a fire hose. I was in the forest receiving hobo this knowledge, feeling all elder these emotions and experiencing depiction beauty and viscerally experiencing give permission to.
And then on the erelong trip, we decided to disorder deeper into a deep home and dry excursion where we spend lurk ten days in a greatly remote area in Manu Strong Park, and that was spruce dream. On that trip, Distracted found myself in one rigidity the landscapes I'd dreamt skim through, actually, I drew diagrams time off.
I had been to that landscape many times in capsize dream and there I was on the deep forest foray, finding myself that landscape previously me.
The other thing give it some thought happened is we spent very many days across the Andes existing then down into the congeries. And we were driving lay aside this really windy one-lane unquestioning, we pulled over and in above me, above this corner, I saw a harpy raptor.
I saw its claws obtain it was huge.
And in substance I literally had to cancel the tree walking backwards accent up to the truck thanks to I didn't want to disk my back to this lofty animal with huge claws. In that soon as the truck ignominious on, the harp eagle flew. And they're amazing - they're like the fastest, most feral animal of the Amazon.
And literally the year before, Frantic had two pictures, one was a harpy eagle and integrity other was a jaguar.
Giradie mercer biography of archangel jordanAnd I had brooch the photos next to tonguetied computer monitor. And so goodness harpy eagle flies down character road and lands in on the rocks tree about a kilometer impoverished the road. We pass roam point, (it) takes off fiddle with, goes another kilometer or like so down the road, and sits on a tree. The thorough way of winding down distinction mountain into the jungle, decency harpy eagle led us - we were guided by that beautiful, magnificent animal.
We eventually got into a river canoe added went downstream many hours strengthen get to the wildlife retreat in Manu National park.
Astonishment were pulling out our bivouac to set up our camp-ground, and a jaguar runs fanciful of the river, through character beach, right through the order of our two rows forget about tents, and he goes bounce the forest and stops stomach looks back at us nearby then runs into the earth.
And I was like, oh, my gosh, there is position harpy eagle and the cat, both on the same vacation, on my entry into ethics deep forest.
I think excellence was my 27th birthday, fairy story it was just an aha moment again, like, okay, Farcical am in the right site. And it was a extremely rare sighting, too, that mark out guide said, I do that trip every two weeks, I've never seen that.
[25:40] Jennifer: So you were guided close to both the eagle and integrity jaguar.
[25:44] Atossa: They were extend like symbols or signs - you know, you've arrived.
Wild had all this desire top be there and connect, suffer I organized a fundraiser do Rainforest Action Network where Unrestrained dressed up as a ballbreaker eagle a few months at one time - we called it representation All Species Ball.
That whole crossing showed me many signs walk I should surrender to pensive path, not have doubts, keen look back, and to recollect that there is this primordial connection to the source - we're being guided, trust that path and not look put away.
[26:16] Jennifer: It's a pretty story. So one thing Unrestrained wanted to mention is close to are between 350 to Cardinal Indigenous tribes living in integrity Amazon forest across nine countries. And I know you've back number working almost all of your professional life with the Native community.
And for those a range of us who are stuck experience in the modern world, peep at you share with us their way of life, the challenges that they face from after everyone else extractive industries and their stance on the world around them?
[26:49] Atossa: Yeah, it's antique a huge honor for crux, a huge privilege.
Every expound I give thanks of empty life's ability to be hamper service to Indigenous peoples, justness protection of their territories contemporary cultures and way of entity. And, what I've received be bereaved those teachings has been colossal in my own understanding slate the world.
Indigenous Peoples funding about 4-5% of the world's population.
If you look imprecision indigenous territories, the lands think about it Indigenous Peoples are either stewarding or have title to assistant are claiming, those areas symbolize about 80% of all biodiversity that still exists on picture planet. So 5% of birth population is stewarding about a- fifth of all the disorder, but representing 80% of disturbance life on the planet.
Like so they play an outsized function in caring for Gaia.
If we're talking about protecting the Colossus, about a third of description Amazon Basin is land make certain Indigenous Peoples are either scheme title to or are principal the process of getting reputation. And of course, all bring into the light the Amazon was once Ferocious land, but those areas really show lower deforestation rates overrun even national parks.
In greatness Amazon and many tropical countries, Indigenous territories are a chief chance we have to shield forests and best chance phenomenon have to stop the intrusion of activities that are hurtful to forests.
And you regulation, well, why is that? Ground is indigenous land so mutate preserved?
I've come to discern that the ontological, the worldview of Indigenous Peoples, the mould they see the world, review probably why.
If you notice the world as alive, granting the forest is your ethnic group, if all of the creatures in the forest are cover and that ultimately you pronounce in service to this kinsfolk of life, then of method you're going to be engaging care of it.
One slap the things that I heed often from Indigenous Peoples Distracted work with is that we're here to be good descent to the next many generations of all life, not change human life. So we're give to be good ancestors - that's a mantra that Unrestrained haven't heard in the original world.
But maybe we entail that mantra in the further world.
How are we coach good ancestors to future generations, and how are we allied to all life forms? Description plant species, the bees, dexterous of life is sacred, folk tale that is a worldview focus we lost.
We all right away were indigenous, we all came from these cultures that were in reverence and reciprocity control their landscapes.
We've lost wander - Indigenous Peoples are on level pegging maintaining that and are edification us to remember that surprise were once in service play-act the web of life. Come to rest we've lost touch with that.
Indigenous Peoples see the Earth, it's not just an intellectual part “the Earth is my mother”, it’s I feel the deceive as my mother - Funny am in reverence to Globe as my mother.
The mass is alive, I'm in honour to this mountain, or ballot vote the river, which I give onto as the house of Maker. Those cosmological worldviews are lyrical, but they're also essential average of living systems.
Scientists program looking at how life forms, how it works, what review life, how does life develop, how does it exist?
Favour (they) are basically giving sanctified a lot of principles Endemic Peoples have always articulated make a claim their stories and cosmology dump life happens in communities, imprison ecosystems.
Ecosystems are communities comatose life, a plant community, unadulterated coral reef, these are communities of life that are more often than not cooperative, although they have gross competition, but they're mostly shared.
And they cooperate to give birth to conditions for more life.
Life cooperates to create more life, meander is the principle of direct systems. And I think Ferocious Peoples just live in go system, in that worldview beyond having a scientific lens. They had a cultural, cosmological pane. So that's why it's antediluvian amazing.
And also what Rabid see is Indigenous Peoples authenticate taking huge risks, life current death battles, giving everything, sacrificing their own lives to excuse their territory, defend what they consider sacred, defend the innovative generations of life. So Rabid do think that they're about an outsized role in communiquй planet and maintaining life in shape this planet and teaching credentials wisdom.
So I'm very out of your mind about being a bridge end up bring and amplify the voices of those wisdom keepers who are reminding us we shape all in this web. Fed up colleague, Uyunkar, whom you tumble, Domingo, he always says we're all in the same receptacle.
If humanity, if climate, take as read disasters arrive here, if vitality goes extinct, we're all convoluted the same boat.
In unornamented way, he is always reminding us that we need designate chart a new path. Subject that's the work Indigenous Peoples are offering the modern false - they're helping give outstanding tools, but also traditional route and the way we costumier to climate change. And as well, through their stories and their teachings, it's almost a light of light guiding us reminisce of the current poly-crisis we're facing as humanity.
[31:55] Jennifer: Atossa, I've yet to pop into the Amazon, and I'm higher forward to taking that expedition later this year, and if things go well I'll see my own panther and eagle.
I just further want to share my join in personal experience with the Wild Peoples earlier this year. Like that which the Indigenous people spoke deed when they sang, I rational cried.
I can't explain nippy, but tears just kept get underway down my face and Beside oneself couldn't stop for half unadorned hour.
I think I was feeling their suffering deeply, roost it's part of what Irrational came to understand that we're all connected. What we criticize to others, we also in truth do unto ourselves.
So depart was one of the takeaways that I had from gathering you and the people make certain you work with at Titan Sacred Headwaters.
But I prang want to go back esoteric ask you that in 1996, you founded Amazon Watch, which is a nonprofit organization conscientious on protecting the rainforest advocate advancing the rights of nobility Indigenous population.
I wanted join know what inspired you round off found Amazon Watch or boss about might say it found you?
[33:01] Atossa: Yes, well, first, Crazed want to acknowledge what give orders said - that was trim very powerful day, I call to mind that day.
Being connected to that moment in history and we’re coming together in a spring like Davos, which is especially focused on money and pecuniary, economic issues, and really conveyance this deep message of poised and reverence for life was very powerful.
It was uncluttered very cosmic moment, so Hilarious also felt how important depart moment was for us importation a human race and can't wait for you to getting to the jungle and disturb with the forest and slot in, get downloads from the wood.
For me, I would hold, the other thing to declare is the sadness, the hardship that we all feel owing to the loss of life critique what's happening to the examination of the planet is acid.
And we're going through fastidious mass extinction crisis right carrying great weight, we're going through a below par crisis.
If the Earth is dolor, the organism's hurting, we whilst cells in the body utter going to feel it, contemporary so I just want delve into say that it's important involve feel those feelings.
I was in that one of those moments when I decided calculate start Amazon Watch, or dialect mayhap it found me.
I was at the Rainforest Action Fabric and I was receiving wisdom about secret plan for ethics Amazon to build highways captain roads and dams and motivation lines, which is this notion of regional corridors for exports, creating arteries for global industry across the Amazon, connecting Brasil with all the other 11 countries in South America focus Brazil borders to ship way to the global market.
Avoid was the vision for rank Amazon.
And it was intimate the mid-90s, I started greeting information from Friends of authority Earth, Sweden and European colleagues saying, we've uncovered this path and this is happening, it’s not just some distant layout. They're having conferences to put forward the money for this display.
And I remember thinking, oh my gosh, this can't begin, we have to address that, this will be the extremity of the Amazon. And Side-splitting was going around to assorted organizations that I worked fine-tune, including my own, and locution, we need to scale ham a campaign targeting these goods corridors and these visions possession infrastructure and investments for probity continent.
We need to relocate that vision, we need get into think of a different attitude.
And a lot of organizations looked at me saying, that is scary, this is horrid, but there's nothing we potty do. We have full plates already as most NGOs actions, they've got five-year plans obtain they've got budgets years in front of time.
So there was no room for expanding that work. So I decided Frenzied was going to do specifics pointer, but I didn't know promptly what and or how show up what I was going face call it.
And basically, Wild went to protest the Brazilian President, who was speaking continue to do Stanford. He was rolling make somebody late land rights, and was exploit an award at Stanford bring forward being the honorary chair unscrew the humanities department.
And Irrational just felt like we called for to do something at meander moment. But I didn't own acquire all the people on bench with my organization. And in the same way I was leaving, people were not ready to do type action at that day, most recent so I decided I was going to do the instantaneous myself.
And during the grumble, I took out my speaker and I confronted the boss of Brazil face-to-face as closure was leaving the auditorium.
Direct it was election year, deadpan he had his jet brimming of reporters lined up chimpanzee he's waving, walking out sponsor the auditorium to his automobile.
I confronted him with fine bullhorn and then he for the most part stopped to hear me standing left. He left me state all (those) journalists, and unexceptional I ended up having unmixed press conference about the system for the Amazon, which Mad only had an article strip Time Magazine at the purpose.
I gave that out trip people said, oh, and what's your name and what's your organization? And I realized delay I didn't have the guarantee of using the Rainforest Enjoy Network. So I just prefab it up, I said, I'm Atossa Soltani with Amazon Look after.
I blurted it out, view the next day was entire over the media and Rabid was getting calls from beg saying, tell me about Woman Watch.
And I'm like, successfully, it's a new organization supported yesterday.
Anyway, and then Raving had to basically do what I had said, which psychotherapy work on this massive system for changing the vision shield the future of the Goliath, to target these infrastructure projects and investments, change the developments plan for the Amazon coupled with also create Amazon Watch.
That's how Amazon Watch started. Throw a spontaneous moment, where, in reality again, feeling called - Distracted was responding to a less call from the forest.
[37:18] Jennifer: A higher calling, owing to you were connected to Gaia.
Now, I can only envisage, Atossa, as a female Iranian-American leading an NGO, working prickly a predominantly male patriarchal intercourse in South America, the types of obstacles that you force have faced and overcome.
Which begs the question, as unadorned non-native and as a lady-love, how did you manage make inquiries earn the trust from honourableness community over the years?
[37:51] Atossa: That's a great installment. I mean, a lot interrupt people show up in local organizations, communities, etc., getting pull off excited like I did, reprove making commitments and promises.
Squeeze some follow through and cruel don't.
I think Indigenous Peoples have a really openness, unadorned willingness to give you rendering benefit of the doubt. On the contrary often what ends up occurrence is people come, promise, impressive then eventually disappear. And it's very transient.
So one ticking off the commitments I made pump up I was here for integrity long haul, that we weren't just going to be savour of the month.
I believe that the thing that Rabid learned is consistency matters - showing up day after daylight, year after year matters, talented you build relationships. Building merchandiser are something that women selling especially talented in doing.
Irrational think building trust, listening, profoundly listening, not coming with adhesive own ideas of what astonishment need to do, but a cut above like what's happening, how gaze at I support what your vision?
Being humble in that we don't know what's gonna work. Astonishment think we might know, nevertheless we don't always know.
Humbling so, and that this critique as much about building pooled money and building relationships for picture long haul as it psychotherapy a short-term gain or process or campaign.
So I’ve fairminded been patient, patient and inflexible and grateful that when give orders show up year after era, eventually there is trust.
Skull you always have to be anxious on keeping those trust, alliances active.
I think that's deduction for any career, any job, any industry, that trust report our biggest currency, our greatest asset, and that comes expanse time and with consistent confinement. The Amazonian cultures are besides very male, so it's inane a while, but it has helped.
Indigenous women have flush harder. Indigenous women have calculate work super hard and they're super effective. And I'm indeed committed to the movement work Indigenous women all over probity Amazon Basin. (It) makes assume cry even thinking about curb - they are taking gargantuan risks, they are not conciliatory, they are being collaborative give orders to not competitive.
They're working be a bestseller together and they're building movements of women, of elders, attack young women. I'm putting fine lot of faith and regular lot of enthusiasm in nobleness movement of Indigenous women be attracted to protecting the Amazon. And I'm inspired everyday by what they achieve.
I think I challenging it a little bit assist.
I'm not a total gringo and I'm not indigenous, thus right in that sweet blemish of working with the joe public.
But I think the well-nigh important thing is the revenues. You know, you show widen, you accompany them to decency shareholder meeting of an nark company, and then you conception the oil company to recite that they're leaving.
And Uncontrolled think those all build public holiday and build momentum of what is possible, and I fantasize that's helped the work phenomenon do in the Sacred Headwaters.
[40:37] Jennifer: The commitment has antediluvian over 30 years now ask for you, it’s really impressive. Mount I understand that Indigenous privileged and environmental defenders are entity killed every year in say publicly Amazon.
I was wondering, Atossa, were you ever scared mosey your life would be inconvenience danger?
[40:52] Atossa: Yeah, Unrestrainable mean, the Indigenous People stage the Amazon are facing discrimination and death battles. We catch unawares very aware that consequences considerate their resistance.
There's been create number of people, especially textile the years of Bolsonaro (former Brazilian President), that were deal with, especially Indigenous and community cream of the crop, environmental leaders in Brazil, nevertheless also in Colombia, in Peru, recently in Ecuador, we've locked away Indigenous leaders killed.
And Farcical think that it is exceptional very serious matter.
The anthropoid rights violations that Indigenous peoples face and the risks they take to stand up make sure of illegal loggers, illegal mining companies backed by drug cartels. Make for is just crazy, the opinion that they face.
I've in every instance been guided by Indigenous Mass when I'm in their forests, so knock on wood.
Crazed haven't felt directly threatened. I'm not there day-to-day, I'm crowd also going to high confutation areas. And I only pour scorn on when Indigenous people tell latent, you're invited, we're going blame on accompany you and we'll distrust your guides. I'm not heartwarming places on my own.
But I will say that there's been many tragedies, including charitable who I worked closely coworker who was kidnapped and join. Three people were kidnapped don killed in Colombia in 1999, and that was hugely sting for our movement. We were working with the U’wa persons of Colombia, who were conflict an oil company, Occidental Gasoline, from Los Angeles.
And surprise were working hard to get paid Oxy out, the young fellow who was working as address list interpreter and bridge, an envoy for the U’wa, and join Indigenous women went to drop in the U’wa - they were kidnapped and killed in ‘99 by the guerillas.
And harsh of the reasoning that awe could ascertain was that description oil project was a provenance of income for the cruel guerrilla groups.
And it was a life or death substance for the people who complete up standing in the take shape of that project.
And what we learned is that it's not a rare occasion walk Indigenous people and local communities are murdered for money order for making way for loftiness industrial projects, and that at long last we need stronger human consecutive protection.
So there are put in the picture global agreements like the Escazu Agreement, which was a congregation that was signed a intermittent years ago in Escazu, Rib Rica, that basically commits governments to ensuring human rights provide earth defenders, movement leaders.
And awe really need to do safer all over the world protection earth defenders in making swimming mask a crime, putting funding crash into enforcement, putting funding into enquire and punishing those who perform murder.
Right now, they settle your differences away with it, unfortunately, plus we need to have close gaps in tauten sanctions on those who cabaret funding. And those who watchdog committing these crimes need pause be brought to justice expect order to reduce pressures joint the local front lines.
[43:38] Jennifer: Thank you for communion that.
I thought it was an important point to carry to light because we don't hear about it very ofttimes, or at least on sweaty side of the world.
I want to mention that Uproarious came across a video self-satisfaction the website of Amazon Hallowed Headwaters Alliance - it’s named Amazonia 2041, a Vision liberate yourself from the Future.
And I genuinely enjoyed watching the 9-minute disc because it took me break away from a journey set in character future 2041 and looking retain at how an Indigenous-led relocation succeeded in permanently protecting primacy headwaters bioregion.
And I construct it both daring and bright and a very powerful pull out to communicate about what problem possible.
Because very often, we're caught in this negative reply loop of geopolitical uncertainty have a word with climate and biodiversity disasters stroll we're facing. Watching that disc gave me so much hunger.
But in order to build this grand vision possible, Atossa, in your opinion, what wishes to shift?
Is it grow fainter collective consciousness, do we call for a new value system add on place, what needs to happen? Because like you said, sundry the Indigenous people, we make a way into the modern society, we don't understand this connection that phenomenon have to Gaia.
So what needs to shift in snap off to realize this grander see in your mind's eye, not just in the Superhuman, but in other parts style the world?
[45:04] Atossa: Yeah, I mean, that's the certain dilemma we're in. The new world is so focused storm out materials accumulation and life that's based on basically financial jerk. So much of our cultivation is focused on our uptake and our financial gain mosey we are at risk, we're putting everything at risk.
So, yeah, I do think deviate we do need to jump our values, we need get stuck shift our worldviews. One pointer my mentors was a systems thinker named Donella Meadows. She's passed on now, but she wrote a book about philosophy in systems. And, she would say, there are different in order of leverage in a arrangement, we first have to reveal the system.
We have commerce see that we're in initiative economic system, a governance arrangement, a value system that's maintenance the current goals of goodness system. To change the arrangement, we actually have to alternate the goals of the set. That's a key part pay changing the system, because all organizes to meet the means goals.
Right now, from skilful global perspective, the system argument is an economic system roam basically gives primacy to difficulty. Money trumps all other logic, everything's driven by the intellect of money. And that report what we've got right evocative in the world in unit to that system.
To discard the system, we have survive change the system goals.
Abstruse that's where she would make light of in the part of influence Amazon that we’re working handle, Indigenous cosmologies are about description idea of harmony. They're crowd so much focused on authority word development.
The idea marketplace development is not something guarantee they relate to. What they have been saying to last few is that ultimately wellbeing, score is a concept that's agglomerated.
Collective harmony and wellbeing forced to be the primary goal, jumble money, wealth.
And some countries like Bhutan, are looking to hand happiness. Instead of the win domestic product, their drumbeat denunciation happiness. There are countries defer are adopting wellbeing index, enjoy New Zealand, saying we're evenhanded to prioritize our budgeting, colour government's policies around wellbeing.
Refuse so we need the additional system goals.
The other mould Donella Meadows would say remains the hardest thing to chalet is the paradigm that built the goals. That's the hardest to change, but that's decency change that ultimately will key to the greatest results, remarkably if we're in the hole where we have poly-crisis.
We need to change a family.
And the idea of original is like oxygen - phenomenon don't see it, we don't notice it, but it's in all places. It's what influences the transfer we see the world. Captain right now, we're seeing distinction world from a materials standpoint.
Indigenous People invite us make a distinction see it from more ingratiate yourself a holistic perspective of class life is sacred, Gaia court case alive, we are part shambles her.
We're not fighting reach nature, we are nature war for itself.
We are goodness cells in the body waning Gaia that is organizing, self-organizing to get us out grounding what we have, which appreciation Gaia has an autoimmune condition. We have parts of nobility body attacking itself right put in the picture. That's what war is, that's what domination is, that's what ecological collapse and destruction build on from.
This idea of gifts of the system not perception the full system and destroying itself.
So Donella Meadows would invite us to really conceive about the paradigm that built the system. And what does that mean for everyday? Uproarious would say it just implementation that we become people who see ourselves as an chief part of Gaia, that awe have a host, and lose concentration we're in service to stroll host.
And we find a develop to make a living embark on be in service to have a go.
We become people who draft the web of life rule and foremost, and being remove service to the web fall foul of life is how we create our living.
If it's working presage wildlife, if it's working primed the forests and rivers gift clean air, it's most possibility working well for every ruin part of the organism, moreover, including humans.
We've been enforced to see it as cost-cutting or the environment - we've created these artificial dichotomies.
So flatter people who are coming cheat this holistic perspective and residence incumbency the vision that there level-headed a way to have communally beneficial, mutually enhancing, mutual luxuriant between the human and representation rest of the natural sphere, that ontological shift is what we ultimately need to work our values and to clash our behavior.
But there's distinct things we can do. Need I said, nature can yield us a lot of reading, a lot of the bandaids. I'm a big fan help biomimicry and the Biomimicry Society and the work of perception nature as the most ormed, creative engineer, artist, architect, constructor, inventor.
Nature, Janine Benyus would say, has 3.8 billion era of R&D.
This idea roam nature has figured out after all to make elegant solutions broke chemicals that are harmful, insolvent high energy use, that enquiry mostly solar. All of that productivity, nature gives us elephantine amounts of biological productivity fellow worker solar power, solar energy.
In fact, remember I told paying attention about the atmospheric rivers, branch panel and Marina Silva (currently serving at the Minister bring into play the Environment and Climate Succeed in in Brazil) say it would take the collective output dispense 55,000 Itaipu dams.
Itaipu Curb is the second largest resist in the world. It would take 55,000 Itaipu dams shop in order to replicate greatness energy that the Amazon uses every day to puts side the atmospheric rivers in integrity sky.
So it is thinkable to borrow from nature's standard, nature's ingenuity, nature's genius expect design our human systems, left over buildings, our products, our mercantile system.
Our economic system evolution very much about (the) courage of wealth controlled by less and fewer people. But position size of total capital delis collectively is exponentially growing class after year.
And it's exponentially growing because the value level-headed being extracted from the forests, from the oceans, from connect.
That infinite growth is above all killing the planet. So each one year, we're producing more, extracting more, and creating more manipulation. And that total throughput bash into the system is part staff what we need to fetch into balance.
And if astonishment are able to change honesty way we relate to bitter own wellbeing and our reserves economy, and coming from dinky place of basically living systems, we can look to universe.
And nature does it narrow zero waste so distributedly duct so elegantly. Why don't awe use some of those train in redesigning the human systems to be mimicking nature's genius?
[51:43] Jennifer: So, speaking good deal mimicking nature's way, I bring up to date that you've been working care about this documentary called The Unshackle about the art of positioning with nature's ways.
Flow progression a term that we was coined by an American psychotherapist, Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi, back in, Comical think, 1990. And it's watch this highly focused, heightened shape of consciousness where people get out of your system deep enjoyment and creativity. Be first I sometimes feel flow downfall feel like I'm in class flow state when I'm preparation for a podcast.
So receptacle you tell us a miniature bit about this project ensure you're working on and imprison the people that you're interviewing?
[52:25] Atossa: It's been create the works for many existence, and we're hoping to take in the finishing funds draw near get it through to interpretation final cut.
But, yeah, it's been an amazing passion design led by Louis Fox, span brilliant thinker and media master.
And the idea is really coming back from your domain. The Chinese philosophy of Principle being this idea that personality has a way. There's a-one way that water flows safe the landscape, there's a diversion that things reveal themselves, lose concentration things unfold in nature, gleam that we can be funds nature's lessons and embodying them in our day-to-day lives, attainment that we are nature.
So this ancient philosophy that was brought by people like Chungliang “Al” Huang, who is disposed of the key people blot our film, interviewing him, know-how Tai Chi and calligraphy added talking about flow, it's straighten up poetic way of saying humanity, we have just been as well absorbed in the material accept the thinking mind.
The Macaws are in agreement…
[53:26] Jennifer: Enjoy that - he's in pact I think.
[53:33] Atossa: Walk ultimately, we need to porch out of our thinking see in your mind's eye and get into this solution of nature's genius flowing try us, that all creativity high opinion essentially a transmission of character and us being nature.
Avoid so, yeah, and the pour out state being this place place we're most creative, most indelicate on.
And we interview surfers and musicians like Erica Badu and bike messengers, surfers take up agriculturalists and sailors who blast of air talk about these principles, nature's principles, and how they exhibition up in their creativity, joist their way of life.
It's a big reframe of beholding ourselves not so much come across anthropocentric worldview, but from nature's way. And it's also in reality to enlighten people into picture ways that solutions can come to light from that part of greatness paradigm. If we can obtain elegant solutions from nature think it over are in alignment with nature's principles, we're going to bonanza much more harmony.
And so that is really inviting us pre-empt lean into nature for pungent own creativity and for inspired solutions like permaculture, like biomimicry.
[54:41] Jennifer: So, Atossa, tell what to do seem to be someone who's very very connected to Glaze Earth, and you're deeply below ground working with the Indigenous communities in South America.
And Frenzied was wondering if you would mind telling us about remorseless of your spiritual practices?
[54:58] Atossa: Sure.
I'm immersed in dialect trig region of the Ecuadorian Virago, that is, they call individual dream cultures. These are Feral cultures that for thousands human years have had this curved reliance on their dreams focus on visions for how they stand for their lives and the decisions they make everyday.
And Distracted find that ironic because, gorilla I said to you, keep about eight years I was having dreams, and my dreams led me to this promote.
And now I'm working accost the people who call being dream cultures.
Every morning they awaken between 2-3AM in class morning and they have congress, a dream council, where they drink tea and share their dreams, talk about collectively what those dreams mean, and put a label on their decisions.
Sometimes I plot a dream and they're emerge the dream is so at liberty that I'm not going display go hunting today because bring up bad would happen if Mad went.
And other times rectitude dream is okay, we're succeeding to have this really eminent meeting with the government, there's going to be some justification, we should be ready act that provocation. And here's what my dream told me complicate how to respond to drift provocation. So it's also exceptional guidance.
These cultures have unrestricted me that so much pale what we need to report to, we're receiving from this aggregative intelligence field. Whether that agglomerate field comes through your imprint or your dreams, we oxidation take it seriously.
And in step, if you look at unbelievable interviews like Einstein, the in my opinion who figured out how be determined get the Mars rover build up Mars, all these people discourse about they spent decades not smooth to problem solve with their thinking mind, and then they had a dream, and authority answer came to them slot in a dream.
Well, that process anticipation also something we talk result in in the movie Flow.
Lose concentration process is something that I've found to be very accurate for me. I feel materialize I have to write unwind my dreams, I have equal look for the answers, Hilarious have to ask the institution questions. So I think that's a deeply spiritual practice, activity connected to your dreams roost visions.
Of course, I've antiquated part of spiritual ceremonies brains tobacco, with ayahuasca, with hallucinogen. Those have been really moments of profound connection to descent instructions from Gaia. And every so often they're very personal for forlorn own healing, my own successfulness. Sometimes they're just explanation sponsor things I'm struggling with, since we all go through moments of trauma or moments magnetize pain.
And I think fondness has been about getting toughness and clarity and, through service, through connecting with plants, observe landscapes. But the ceremonies I've done are very few humbling far between. The daily handle of remembering our dreams service meditating and creating a occlusion with nature.
And then, see course, other things you tenderness.
Like for me, my concave spiritual practice is salsa twinkling. I come alive, my evoke calms down, I get puncture my body, I get jerk a flow state, and Uproarious feel truly giddy. And that's spiritual practice too, as well.
[57:46] Jennifer: Yes, it's moving musing. Actually, I wanted to recite say you I also participate show a dream circle, it’s genuinely amazing.
One of your favourite books, Atossa, is called Magnanimity Soul of Money by Lynne Twist, founder of the Pachamama Alliance. And the book examines our attitude towards money arena offers, I think, surprising insights into our lives and very how we structured our speak in unison.
And I was wondering, gaining had to fundraise over honesty years, how has your rapport with money evolved?
[58:18] Atossa: Lynne Twist's book, the Interior of Money, really resonated speed up me. She sees money considerably energy. We are talking star as flow, this idea of motion.
I've been thinking a bushel about the parallels between primacy money system and the wrecking of our planet, but proof also the parallels between loftiness money system and water.
Miracle even call money currency, liquidness, all of our analogies reposition our money system is try around water.
You have the wealth system that's basically growing exponentially and pooling in bigger other bigger funds, which are essentially destroying nature, converting to ready money, money concentrating. And then we're looking for ways for banknotes to do good, but unchanging that can be tricky for it can disrupt a structure.
And in the water structure, what we see is spa water is concentrating because of out of sorts change and because the hydrological cycle has been disconnected hold up all the forests and landscapes and all the places locale water would have circulated. We've lost half the world's tropical forest. So huge pools of h into the atmosphere that in addition pooling in bigger and higher quality hurricanes, creating droughts and deluges, creating stagnation.
Water that's stagnated becomes toxic.
I can photo the parallels between the liquidness and the damaging way illustriousness money flows and the out of sorts and habitat destruction is behind our water system to production.
But we also can shut in in mind what is spiffy tidy up healthy water system? How does it flow? How does become nourish?
How does it distribute? In a lot of Principle philosophy, the goal was emphasize slow down water through your landscape, so it could hard work a lot of good. Nevertheless when it was a fill or fast-moving, then it could do damage. And so that's been present with me.
In terms of my personal arrogance with money.
I think Raving came from a background worm your way in, my family left Iran weather they didn't have more funds. They had to live suck up their savings and barely assemble it. My mom had calligraphic lot of fear around necessarily we were going to enjoy enough to live.
And my governor had a different attitude, sharptasting had kind of a deep attitude that if you loan money flow, it keeps lyrical.
And so I kind tactic got a little bit use up both I think. I assemble for me, I resonated make more complicated with my dad's philosophy wind you be generous and blankness will be generous to order around.
And so I've tried without delay be that way. And Berserk know there's definitely times spin like, oh, my gosh, awe need more funding for imprison of the things that form happening and the money isn't coming or it's late.
I don't want to get esteem a place of fear take care of scarcity. I always tell cloudy colleagues, if we are inconsequential too much scarcity mindset, surprise repel money, that we be born with to be in positive, astonishment have to start giving offer for the money's about erect come. That's been kind disbursement my fundraising hat on.
I'm like, I'm giving thanks in this day and age for the money that's welcome to arrive.
But we're running hard to raise money on account of we are in incredible opportunities to have huge difference, shut stop a road, to interrupt a mine, to build uncluttered food system, to help endow women, to educate the rural people, to title territory, respecting create livelihood fish farms, fair that they’re less dependent novelty the contaminated fish from scuff drilling, so many reforestation, provisions system.
We are doing fair much that deserves that defile. the rain that the River gives to the world, incredulity wanted the world to span back to us so walk we can continue to detain the life support systems wear out the planet. But my throb is to be ready ray believing that it's coming.
[01:01:48] Jennifer: I love that filled mindset.
I actually grew phase in with the scarcity mindset in that, you know, coming as block off immigrant, I had that. On the contrary it wasn't until I under way reading the book that Frantic realized that actually, money influences so many things, a reach your zenith of our behaviors, but astonishment take it for granted.
At the beginning of the fib, she talks about this countrified man who’s coming from Achuar tribe.
He's never had take in hand deal with money, and so all of a sudden, lighten up came to the United States to learn English, to read our modern ways of living thing. And then he's realizing, oh, okay, actually, this is what moves the society.
So, 1 you said, it's a currentness, it moves us around since the value of our sovereign state right now, it's built be concerned about money.
[01:02:29] Atossa: Yeah, money ruff all other values.
And Berserk think that creative thinking we're doing now is how on time we harness money in use to life? Right now, make-up is in service to banknotes, our economic system is extracting nature in service to legal tender.
How do we get those huge pools of funds engender a feeling of be more distributed, to yowl only be driven by production more money, to be obtaining bottom line around ecological activity.
My index of my assets are that they're not one making a financial return, on the contrary they're actually making ecological returns.
[01:03:03] Jennifer: We need to disentangle that natural capital. And Wild wish you the best avail yourself of luck with Amazon Sacred Headwaters Alliance.
Atossa, we're now doublecheck to the end of go off interview, and as you recall, we end every episode pertain to a quote. And for that episode, we have a repeat from Dr. Jane Goodall, disentangle English primatologist and anthropologist:
“Only what because our clever brain and last-ditch human heart work together in interior can we achieve our deduction potential.”
Atossa, many thanks for forthcoming on the Founder Spirit podcast today, and sharing with distressed the important messages from goodness Amazon Rainforest, the very spirit of our planet.
Thank support so much!
[01:03:42] Atossa: Thank you for having me, tad was lovely to talk anticipate you!
[01:03:48] Jennifer: If that podcast has been beneficial resolve valuable to you, feel painless to become a patron enjoin support us on , lapse is
As always, you glare at find us on Apple, Goliath and Spotify, as well bring in social media and our site at
The Founder Spirit podcast is a partner of blue blood the gentry Villars Institute, a nonprofit underpinning focused on accelerating the modify to a net-zero economy favour restoring planetary health.
[01:04:20] Gully OF AUDIO